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推翻美国宪法第二修正案?洗洗睡吧

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发表于 2018-3-27 16:15 | 只看该作者 |只看大图 回帖奖励 |倒序浏览 |阅读模式
本帖最后由 满地找牙 于 2018-3-27 16:24 编辑



https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/repealing-the-second-amendment-–-is-it-even-possible/ar-BBKMVCX?ocid=spartandhp


Repealing the Second Amendment – is it even possible?

"
In the history of the United States, the only amendment that's ever been repealed is Prohibition. The 21st Amendment, in 1933, repealed the 18th Amendment, of 1919, which prohibited the making, transportation and sale of alcohol. "





Retired Supreme Court Justice John Paul Stevens called for a repeal of the Second Amendment in a New York Times op-ed Tuesday, and he urged demonstrators pressing for gun control to do the same. His bold proposal has prompted many questions about whether such a fundamental change to the U.S. Constitution is legally – let alone politically – possible.
   

"For over 200 years after the adoption of the Second Amendment, it was uniformly understood as not placing any limit on either federal or state authority to enact gun control legislation," Stevens wrote.
That changed in 2008, when the Supreme Court ruled in the case of District of Columbia v. Heller that there is an individual right to bear arms. Stevens was one of four dissenters.

"That decision – which I remain convinced was wrong and certainly was debatable – has provided the N.R.A. with a propaganda weapon of immense power. Overturning that decision via a constitutional amendment to get rid of the Second Amendment would be simple and would do more to weaken the N.R.A.'s ability to stymie legislative debate and block constructive gun control legislation than any other available option," Stevens wrote.

But just how "simple" – or difficult – is it to repeal a constitutional amendment, and how does the repeal process work?
Experts say there are two ways to go about it. The first process requires that any proposed amendment to the Constitution be passed by both the House and the Senate with two-thirds majorities. It would then need to be ratified by three-fourths of the 50 states – or 38 of them.

Historically, that's proved challenging.

The "arduous process has winnowed out all but a handful of the amendments proposed over the past 230 years," Ron Elving, senior editor and correspondent on the Washington Desk for NPR News, wrote earlier this month.

"Even relatively popular ideas with a big head of steam can hit the wall of the amendment process. How much more challenging would it be to tackle individual gun ownership in a country where so many citizens own guns — and care passionately about their right to do so?" Elving wrote. He pointed out the "tremendous support" gun ownership has in large parts of the nation, especially the South, West and Midwest, "which would easily total up to more than enough states to block a gun control amendment."

The second option for repealing an amendment is to hold a Constitutional Convention. In that case, two-thirds of state legislatures would need to call for such a convention, and states would write amendments that would then need to be ratified by three-fourths of the states.

While it's theoretically possible to change the Constitution this way, "that's never happened since the Constitution was ratified," said Kevin McMahon, an expert in constitutional law and a professor of political science at Trinity College in Hartford, Connecticut.

In the history of the United States, the only amendment that's ever been repealed is Prohibition. The 21st Amendment, in 1933, repealed the 18th Amendment, of 1919, which prohibited the making, transportation and sale of alcohol.  

McMahon told CBS News it's "very unlikely" that the Second Amendment could ever be repealed.

"It's hard enough for gun control legislation to be passed now in the Congress which requires simply a simple majority," he said.
A repeal would require "a sea change" in how Americans think about gun control and the right to bear arms, McMahon said.
"I would never say it's impossible," but "it is very difficult to enact a constitutional amendment," he said.

Stevens' call for a repeal is not the first remark from a former member of the Supreme Court against the Second Amendment. As The Atlantic reports, former Chief Justice Warren Burger said in 1991: "If I were writing the Bill of Rights now, there wouldn't be any such thing as the Second Amendment."

Speaking on the MacNeil/Lehrer NewsHour, he said the amendment on "the right of the people to keep and bear arms" was the subject of "one of the greatest pieces of fraud – I repeat the word 'fraud' – on the American public by special-interest groups that I have ever seen in my lifetime."

Since then, there have been other calls to look again at the Second Amendment. Bret Stephens, a conservative columnist for the New York Times, has endorsed the idea of repeal, writing: "Gun ownership should never be outlawed, just as it isn't outlawed in Britain or Australia. But it doesn't need a blanket Constitutional protection, either."

Recently, filmmaker Michael Moore suggested rewording the amendment to say: "A well regulated State National Guard, being helpful to the safety and security of a State in times of need, along with the strictly regulated right of the people to keep and bear a limited number of non-automatic Arms for sport and hunting, with respect to the primary right of all people to be free from gun violence, this shall not be infringed."

Following last month's fatal shooting at a Florida high school, and as a movement rose out of the shooting, the national gun debate surged – once again – into the spotlight. Inspired by student survivors of the Feb. 14 Parkland massacre, an estimated 200,000 protesters gathered in Washington, D.C., on Saturday to push for gun control.

Stevens wrote in his op-ed that the demonstrations "demand our respect." But he said protesters "should seek more effective and more lasting reform."

"They should demand a repeal of the Second Amendment," he wrote.

Aaron Blake, senior political reporter writing for The Fix at The Washington Post, told CBS News that in his view, Stevens' op-ed was "about the most unhelpful thing" for the gun control movement.

"This is playing into the Republican talking point that this is the ultimate goal of gun control advocates, which is to take away guns, to not have gun ownership be a right, to repeal the Second Amendment," Blake said.



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沙发
发表于 2018-3-27 16:25 | 只看该作者
只要当政者有足够的决心和实力修改一个宪法没啥不可能,迟早的事。美国已经在走下坡路了
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发表于 2018-3-27 16:59 | 只看该作者
Colt1911 发表于 2018-3-27 16:25
只要当政者有足够的决心和实力修改一个宪法没啥不可能,迟早的事。美国已经在走下坡路了 ...

你说包子?
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地板
发表于 2018-3-27 17:25 | 只看该作者
Colt1911 发表于 2018-3-27 17:25
只要当政者有足够的决心和实力修改一个宪法没啥不可能,迟早的事。美国已经在走下坡路了 ...

修宪还要看各州批准情况,这点是制约联邦的关键,毕竟蓝州只是人口多,红州数量还是大。
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发表于 2018-3-27 17:26 | 只看该作者


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发表于 2018-3-27 17:29 | 只看该作者
moses80h 发表于 2018-3-27 17:25
修宪还要看各州批准情况,这点是制约联邦的关键,毕竟蓝州只是人口多,红州数量还是大。
...

美国南北战争就是因为北方违宪阻止南方州脱离联邦而造成的,死了几十万人;为了禁枪再违一次也不是没有可能,宪法是人写的,而且那只是一个修正案,再修一次就行了

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发表于 2018-3-27 17:36 | 只看该作者
Colt1911 发表于 2018-3-27 17:29
美国南北战争就是因为北方违宪阻止南方州脱离联邦而造成的,死了几十万人;为了禁枪再违一次也不是没有可 ...

应该不会有内战,政客们牺牲不起肉身。
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发表于 2018-3-27 17:45 | 只看该作者
uper 发表于 2018-3-27 17:36
应该不会有内战,政客们牺牲不起肉身。

内战应该不会,但为了修宪,镇压小规模抗议还是可能的,这种代价很小,但完全可以达到左派的目的。
1957年小石城事件,联邦政府也是派了军队镇压的。不同的是,上次是黑白对立,这次是禁枪派和拥枪派的对立。
没有人会为了几条枪和政府拉锯的,抗议过后能怎样呢?
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发表于 2018-3-27 17:59 来自手机 | 只看该作者
政客自己又不打仗。他们有什么好牺牲的。我同意@colt1911的看法,上次内战就是公然违宪的做法,还不是就做了?再来第二次内战不是完全没有可能。现在左派就是在造声势,有了足够的舆论准备,修宪就是下一步目标。如果修宪不成,内战也在考虑之中。
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发表于 2018-3-27 18:25 | 只看该作者
Colt1911 发表于 2018-3-27 19:29
美国南北战争就是因为北方违宪阻止南方州脱离联邦而造成的,死了几十万人;为了禁枪再违一次也不是没有可 ...

你混淆了违宪和修宪的区别。 违宪容易,干了就是了。 比如通过一项违反第二修正案的法案,而且最高法院不干预就行。 比如某个民主党总统期间几个保守大法官同时退休或暴毙, 上任几个左派大法官,不干预违宪控枪法是完全可能的。 修宪可是有既定程序的。只要13个州反对就搞不成。
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发表于 2018-3-27 18:37 | 只看该作者
Colt1911 发表于 2018-3-27 18:29
美国南北战争就是因为北方违宪阻止南方州脱离联邦而造成的,死了几十万人;为了禁枪再违一次也不是没有可 ...

内战是不可能的,更简单办法是趁两院总统都在自己手里的时候暗杀所有保守派大法官再提名自己的人就行了。到时候怎么解释宪法就随便了。
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发表于 2018-3-27 18:50 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 Colt1911 于 2018-3-27 18:51 编辑
QuiMi 发表于 2018-3-27 18:25
你混淆了违宪和修宪的区别。 违宪容易,干了就是了。 比如通过一项违反第二修正案的法案,而且最高法院不 ...

美国这么搞下去,各个州都向左看齐就够了
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发表于 2018-3-27 18:50 来自手机 | 只看该作者
那倒也是。肯定是哪个成本低先做哪个吧。现在成本最低的是重新解释2A,然后制订控枪禁枪法律。
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发表于 2018-3-27 19:17 | 只看该作者
QuiMi 发表于 2018-3-27 18:25
你混淆了违宪和修宪的区别。 违宪容易,干了就是了。 比如通过一项违反第二修正案的法案,而且最高法院不 ...

嗯,违宪容易,修宪难。违宪是只要自己违反就可以了,修宪是要所有人同意你违反。基于现在美国三亿人有两亿枪的现状,其实拥枪的不在少数,只不过有枪的人都没有上街游行,所以大家觉得反枪声势浩大,在加上媒体的煽风点火,让公众都以为现在大家都在朝向禁枪的方向发展。


枪者, 民之大事, 死生之器,存亡之技,利害不可不察也;夫学枪者, 当敬而近之,慎而习之。
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发表于 2018-3-27 19:20 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 uper 于 2018-3-27 19:24 编辑
moses80h 发表于 2018-3-27 18:37
内战是不可能的,更简单办法是趁两院总统都在自己手里的时候暗杀所有保守派大法官再提名自己的人就行了。 ...

战争不可能一下子打起来,估计是先各种街头暴力,还有,双方都会打冷枪。我们可能怂,这么多gun owner, 肯定有不怂的,有个什么流血事件,就是怂的gun owner选择也不多了,投降把枪交给左左吧,左左这时候也拿着枪,恐怕是更大的杀器。你缴枪给他们后不怕他们把气撒在你头上(别的不说,你有这么多枪,还有ass weap,  又是nra member,左左早给你定性了- you have blood on your hand).
有这些就足够让人人自危,谁都需要枪,  还禁个皮呀,所以我认为废2a基本扯淡。几十年后有可能(所以人都被洗脑成作弊,但基本不可能),可惜左棍没有江总的智慧, 韬光养晦,而是早早的图穷匕见,现在就喊出废2a的口号,


'There'll Be a Civil War': Watters Blasts John Paul Stevens' Call for 2nd Amendment Repeal

http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/ ... ent-and-gun-control
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发表于 2018-3-27 19:30 | 只看该作者
内战吧,美国四分五裂各个州独立自治也不错。
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发表于 2018-3-27 20:05 | 只看该作者
本帖最后由 uper 于 2018-3-27 20:07 编辑
leohe8888 发表于 2018-3-27 19:30
内战吧,美国四分五裂各个州独立自治也不错。

同意,不信作弊能治国。就那加州说,现在看不错,硅谷,stanford,可这都是过去百年的底子,这一百年可没有这么左过。独立了首先sca5成法律,公司招人必须按种族。大批illegal, ms13蜂拥而至,犯罪率暴增,看看硅谷能撑多少年。

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发表于 2018-3-27 21:11 | 只看该作者
在美国,平民不再拥枪,恶性犯罪会多得人们不得不重新考虑拥枪。
“再美好的理念也敌不过“人的自私基因”;绝对民主,绝对动乱(分裂);无限民主,无限动乱(分裂)!”
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发表于 2018-3-28 07:11 | 只看该作者
趁美国现在还有人保有对宪法的尊重,应该赶紧鼓励民主党把修宪写入党章,然后让高院不能再回避,直接给出判定。

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发表于 2018-3-31 15:25 来自手机 | 只看该作者
2/3國會議員提案,3/4州制憲議會通過才行,修憲那麼簡單,civil war之前先修再打多好啊
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